There is nothing wrong with standing up for your friends. It does not make you emo or over dramatic. However, I ask are you really suprised by the stand of the officers in your guild? If they wont deguild the person who makes derogatory and insulting comments daily in guild chat why would they censor that persons post on the guild website.
On a sidenote I would personally not support censorship like that, when I helped mod Darkbloods forums we almost never deleted a post no matter how much we disagreed with it. Some of you who had access to the forums may remember some of Ssoulz's extremely annoying and argumentative posts.
People who play online games are lulled into believing that their guild is their online family and that the people you play with are your friends. That is almost never really true. The artificial closeness of online gaming can trick you into believing that these people are your friends but in reality they are almost never real friends. Guilds in eq wow or any other game are just groups of people who gather for common self interest, to get loot, see harder content or socialize.
The person who you feel is rude or insulting probably is an everyday competent or exceptional player who pulls his/her weight in the guild therefore almost any flaw will be overlooked in order to advance the common goal of the guild to raid and accumulate loot. Thats just life in an online guild.
/hugz though
Soul searching... or... am i *emo*?
So, some background, I think it is relevant.
I am a 34 year old married mother of two school children. I live in Australia. I have left-wing liberal political leanings. My husband is a police Prosecutor, you would call him a District Attorney in the states. (he isn't a persecutor, as someone accidentally misread once). My mother introduced me to Everquest in 2001. She has been playing the game since 1999. Over my gaming years, I have joined a few different guilds as my playtime and character development allowed.
That somewhat covers enough I think for the insight required.
My most recent guild raided 5 nights (though 8pm EST is my midday, I play during my daytime). We raid highend and we have a more adult demographic. This isn't to say guildchat was an R-rated experience, more that everyone had a maturity that is sometimes lacking in the more hardcore "college" guilds.
One of the guild has a personality that many found abrasive, myself included. I generally ignored his obnoxious comments or made lighthearted jibes back at him. More recently his attacks have gotten more and more personal and insulting. Not just to the person they are directed at, but I find it insulting to have to read it when he attacks another of my online friends. He has been repeatedly taken to by the officers. He quietens down for a period then returns to his nasty verbosity.
So, a couple of months ago, on of my dearest online friends got married. To his EQ sweetheart. Yes, in real life, they hitched up. She though lives in the US and he is in Canada. She is in the process of immigration, which can take a considerable amount of time. She is in a different guild to me and my friend, though she was in our guild about a year ago, but left in part due to the same person I am ranting about.
My friend decided to leave our guild to apply to his wife's guild. This is the top guild on my server, they are not "easy" to get in to, his passage isn't guaranteed. But he wants to spend his online time with his wife as they get such little real life time together until her immigration comes through.
Rather than just leave in the middle of our guild's progression attempts, he waits until all the flagging is done, but leaves before getting any loot calls from the newly entered content (so noone can say he was just gearing up to leave). He has been with the guild for nearly 2 years. Hardly a guild hopper. His previous guild, my previous guild also... left for EQ2. He is NOT a guild hopper.
And yet that is what the aforementioned rude person posted on my friends farewell post. In very unkind tones. Now, my friend wouldn't ever see the words, his access to the forums would have been revoked before he had the opportunity.
But it really hurt me. I think its incredibly vulgar to bad mouth someone who you played a game such as EQ with over such a long time, even if you disagree with their choices. So, I said so. I said I wanted the officers to direct the person to take down his posts. They didn't. They said I was being dramatic. I beg to differ.
If someone repeatedly posts rude and hurtful comments that are DESIGNED to be hurtful. And is unapologetic for his hurtfulness, why on earth would you continue to let him keep doing it? So, I left my guild. I love this guild, it is easily the nicest bunch of people I have ever met in game. If I had the money I would go to Vegas next March to meet them, as they have a yearly get together there.
But I feel this is a matter of principle. I can't be in the same guild as that guy. Every time he opens his mouth it is offensive to someone, and by extension it offends me. He doesn't treat his guildies with respect. And yet the officers continue to let him keep his tag.
So, does this make me pathetically EMO? or do I have a point? I would like to think that my friends would stick up for me in reverse circumstances, but it seems like that isn't the case. One of the officers said I need to compromise. How do you compromise that kind of standard? What this guy does isn't "ok". Its cruel and mean. I can't just let it slide.
Ok, I think I am done. I left my guild and as such probably wont be playing EQ anymore. I don't want to go through an application process to another guild, and I hate just being a tagless LFG rogue. So, my lovely dark elf is sitting in a quiet corner of POK, probably fleecing the guards. Or playing dice and fleecing the guards that way. It all ended so abruptly I never had time to feel sad about her being retired. I just feel pissed off that it had to end like this. Someone hug me OMGZ
Maelgrim
18 years ago
Lolanae
18 years ago
*HUGS**HUGS**HUGS*
I agree with you. If someone is causing that much discontent, SOMETHING needs to be done about them. We recently just had a person that can be at times rather rude come back into the guild. I asked flat out if he had been warned because I wasn't going to put up with it anymore.
The officers should be doing something about that person, not saying that you were being dramatic. And if you can't say something good in someone's good bye post, just don't post.
I agree with you. If someone is causing that much discontent, SOMETHING needs to be done about them. We recently just had a person that can be at times rather rude come back into the guild. I asked flat out if he had been warned because I wasn't going to put up with it anymore.
The officers should be doing something about that person, not saying that you were being dramatic. And if you can't say something good in someone's good bye post, just don't post.
tamaelia
18 years ago
To clarify, I wasn't really looking for censorship from the officers. I was looking for them to direct the member to self-censor, which he should have had the decency to do before he click "reply". We can all make posts in the heat of the moment. What I found sad was that noone called him out for being the rude shit he was.
And you are right, Maelgrim, when you talk about assuming a guild = "family" or suchlike. I am probably not that naive, though there are a few folks I game with that I would call friends although I haven't met them in person. We have talked plenty in game, over IM, and on the phone in a couple of instances. I am comfortable thinking of them as friends.
One thing that used to bug me alot, about many guilds, is the importance placed on the "tag" you wear over the head of the online avatar. As if it is sacred. Ooooh, don't do something that brings shame on your tag. *horror* And if you detag it is somehow a huge insult to the guild because you didn't treasure the tag. Curiously, to me the important thing was how people treated each other, not how they treated the tag.
Maybe I really am getting too old for this stuff. I tire easily of being lectured about things that are only important in the context of a virtual world. That is certainly how it looks now I am on the other side of the fence. I played the game because of a few things, I enjoyed the actual gameplay; it gave me extra means to chat with my mum and brother who both played; the challenge of growing your character; the roleplaying side of it; the guild/raiding teamwork aspect.
I see alot of lipservice about showing respect to your fellow guildies, and not seeing it followed through. Respect isn't just an Aretha Franklin song!
At least now I have more time for art!
And you are right, Maelgrim, when you talk about assuming a guild = "family" or suchlike. I am probably not that naive, though there are a few folks I game with that I would call friends although I haven't met them in person. We have talked plenty in game, over IM, and on the phone in a couple of instances. I am comfortable thinking of them as friends.
One thing that used to bug me alot, about many guilds, is the importance placed on the "tag" you wear over the head of the online avatar. As if it is sacred. Ooooh, don't do something that brings shame on your tag. *horror* And if you detag it is somehow a huge insult to the guild because you didn't treasure the tag. Curiously, to me the important thing was how people treated each other, not how they treated the tag.
Maybe I really am getting too old for this stuff. I tire easily of being lectured about things that are only important in the context of a virtual world. That is certainly how it looks now I am on the other side of the fence. I played the game because of a few things, I enjoyed the actual gameplay; it gave me extra means to chat with my mum and brother who both played; the challenge of growing your character; the roleplaying side of it; the guild/raiding teamwork aspect.
I see alot of lipservice about showing respect to your fellow guildies, and not seeing it followed through. Respect isn't just an Aretha Franklin song!
At least now I have more time for art!
ROzbeans
18 years ago
Yeah...like I told you earlier, Tam, the few of us here that knew each other on solro would tell you that your guild sounds a lot like a guild we were all in. =x Man we had a good time though. There were a few who didn't get our almost cosmic joke on 'hate' but honestly we just meant it all in fun. Some just took it a tad too far. That asshole is probably a good player - much like I didn't get kicked out of Triad because I was a cleric and those are just too hard to come by, so why not tolerate the mouthy bitch who does free sigs.
God. Good times.
In any case, you'll enjoy the free time you have now though, I know I do. 6 years of playing, the last 3 raiding as hard as I could with a little wee one and a full time job. I wasted my life on eq but I did make good friends. You have that as well from your guild. In the end, that guy is just an asshole with a small penis and no life.
/hug
God. Good times.
In any case, you'll enjoy the free time you have now though, I know I do. 6 years of playing, the last 3 raiding as hard as I could with a little wee one and a full time job. I wasted my life on eq but I did make good friends. You have that as well from your guild. In the end, that guy is just an asshole with a small penis and no life.
/hug
tamaelia
18 years ago
Wow, its like you are a seer... or something!
Roz r wise.
Roz r wise.