DAY ONE - /OOC Chatter

I have to agree with Tor on some things, I think.. reading the SK hit it does jump out about medicine and that instantly makes me think nurses. And calm detachment.. fits an ER or a military nurse so no help narrowing it further there. So a nurse OR a doctor would be the best fit. Except nowdays almost everyone has seen ER, Grey's Anatomy, House, etc etc.. and if there was a gaping wound in his chest even a non medically trained person would have a decent idea he was pretty bad off. We have 3 "possible" SK suspects. I think the horse mentioned was about the only way to draw a parallel for what the SK was supposedly trying to rationalize, so didn't strike me as too much of a clue. Survivor.. everyone there has been called that, since they are. It's about as generic a term as can be applied to everyone.

Adding to the poor nurses being implicated - and going back to shooting the horse... if i read the bios right, only 3 people are carrying guns - Emerald, Kassidy and Nic - and since I know it ain't Nic :twisted: ) that just add's to Emeralds guilt...

course, alot of this is stretching and knowing our mods i would not be in the least surprised to know that we've totoally missed the real clues and are on a wild goose chase... *grin*

Ok -- first off, why would someone using an access hatch have to be small? Surely they make those things big enough for a normal person to fit through them...I don't know of a large number of companies who employ short people for this purpose :P

Second, loving children doesn't make a person sympathetic to everyone - therefore, just because Carly loves kids, wouldn't make her good around someone mortally wounded. Besides...even the sight of blood made her sick to her stomach :P

However, Emerald has a nursing, and army background, both of which I think are key here. She would know that Vern was mortally wounded, and she would be strong enough to push him over the edge, looking towards expediency rather than a compassionate method of putting him out of his misery.

Going back to the size issue again puts Carly out of the running...whoever pushed Vern over the side would have needed strength...aka someone in the military.

I don't get the whole 'wrapping in sheet' connection though, since that had to have been done by someone AFTER Vern had died, and been discovered. That seems weak, as does the 'survivor' connotation, the 'short' aspect, and the 'disturbed' reference, at least when it comes to the SK. I think the SK is Emerald, because of her nursing/army background.

The poor nurses are not the only ones with first aid training. One cookie loving girl scout has some basics as well.

In the SK Hit:

The SK knew there was no hope for Vern without modern medicine.

The SK thinks that if Vern lived he would be a burden on the group.

Vern was pushed off the ledge

Vern was buried in a garden grave.


In Kassidy “Cookies” Maldonado’s Bio:

Doesn’t want to test out the first aid badge. So obviously knows first aid and how to recognize when it isn’t going to be enough.

Says she ‘got ta be a bit more of a handful’ sounds like a burden to me

She could not lift her parents in their separate boxes so she put a big box in the hole and the slide them in.

Buried her parents using potting soil and put in some flower seeds.

On the survival theme, her bio discusses moths that adapt to survive. It also discusses that it is better for the children to survive, might explain some detachment.

Where the nurses seem very likely, they also seem very obvious. Just a thought.

Walking slowly doesnt really suggest tired imo. It says slow, but unhesitantly. The steps were more likely predatory, like a pack of wolves surrounding their prey. If the killers were tired, they'd perhaps not have had the strength to throw him off the side?

On the service hatch thing, I think its more likely width than height that is a factor. I'm short in RL, but I'm broad shouldered so still have trouble getting through places like that.

im at work and on my way out the door, so i only had time for a quick read through the SK hit and peoples replies in this thread. the main thing that grabbed my attention immediately from the SK hit was the way he/she talks:



perhaps its nothing, or perhaps its something. with the effort the mods put into writing each hit and carefully hiding even the most subtle of clues, why wouldnt something as important as the killers actual words receive the same careful attention?

also, i dont think that verns burial was done by the killer. it happens at the very end of the hit, as the people are moving on. i think it might be irrelevant in the sense that the killer didnt actually bury him, but it may still contain important clues.

there was a "rising sun" phrase which stood out to me the first time I read it - fits our token oriental guy Hank

Rest of this stuff looks deep so hopefully later at work - haven't had time yet

Jet and Carly bring up good points on the service hatch thing. I was thinking more along the lines of an electrician's service opening, which can be pretty damn small, but it does say hatch, which would probably be at least manhole sized?

The rising sun works with the cold to implicate the evils of Asia, but I don't think there's enough going to point clearly to the punk...I mean, Hank. (and trust me, I've been looking for ways to make him look guilty - gnomes can't be trusted) ;)

Overall, I'd say the round 1 Mafia hints were a bit more clear. I'm also leery about lynching a nurse before the Doctor is found - personal bias of mine. But we've still got hours of discussion to decide.

has anyone studied the quotes at the beginning of each kill? I think there could be big clues in them.

The rising sun clue could also work for Emerald who was stationed in Japan and Tibet.

Whether or not the service hatch is small or generously proportioned is a moot point.

The SK was exceedingly careful when he/she came through the service hatch and lowered themselves onto the metal structure - the grid. From the text the SK knew that the grid wasn't entirely safe to walk upon, and that in certain places a person would go straight through. Either the SK is very observant or has a knowledge of structural design - specifically the Needle.

The caution of the SK is more apparent in that he/she crawled slowly to Verm and did not walk on the grid. The distance from the service hatch to the grid itself would give an indicator of the SK's height, but we are not told that.

The SK crawling to Vern could indicate that he/she is tall or not, or just very aware of how dangerous the grid can be for the unwary.

When disposing of Vern the SK is in a crouching position when they roll, not push or lift, Vern over the side. Rolling a full grown man is not beyond the capabilities of the majority of the characters and is not a good indicator of the SK being a strong individual.

The medicial analysis made by the SK is rather general. No specifics or attempts to ascertain the extent of Vern's injuries. It could mean a trained medical eye as some have suggested, someone who has seen injuries before like a law enforcement officer or solider, or it could mean an avid TV watcher of medical dramas/reality shows.

And with a gaping wound in his chest, anyone could see that Vern was in a world of hurt.

The reference to shooting a horse with a broken leg isn't as straight forward as it seems. The analogy drawn by the SK between Vern and a horse is misleading. Modern veterinary science is such that a horse with a broken leg isn't the Humpty Dumpty that can't be put back together again.

The SK might not know that or they could be aware just why a horse with a broken leg can be so heartbreaking.

It is the horse's repeated attempts to regain it's balance that often leads to more fractures and pain, and in the days when the leg could not be reliably set it often meant putting the poor horse out of its misery than allowing it to live.

Perhaps this is why the SK makes the remark about Vern being like a horse with a broken leg, and interestingly, a burden that would be sick for a long time even if he was lucky enough to survive his injuries.

But why go to the trouble of rolling Vern off the Needle when suffocating or breaking the neck could have sufficed. Perhaps the SK didn't have that sort of training, or the strength to accomplish that. So instead the SK rolls Vern off the side of grid with an apologetic look and an ironic parting sentence.

That the SK stays crouched on the grid to make sure Vern was killed by the fall is interesting. Anyone with medical or military training would know a fall like that would certainly kill Vern. There would be no sense in watching the end result. Perhaps the SK needed to feel a sense of closure, or maybe it was a vouyeristic streak. Although unlikely, the SK could have feared that somehow Vern had survived.

But Vern is dead and the survivors are left with no answers, only more questions as they begin the trek out of Seattle.

So Lincoln...all good theories on who DIDN'T do it...any on who did??

You tell me...

:cute

Four Winds you made some great points but I don't agree with this

"That the SK stays crouched on the grid to make sure Vern was killed by the fall is interesting. Anyone with medical or military training would know a fall like that would certainly kill Vern. There would be no sense in watching the end result. Perhaps the SK needed to feel a sense of closure, or maybe it was a vouyeristic streak. Although unlikely, the SK could have feared that somehow Vern had survived."

Instead I think this doesn't tell us anything as they were simply cautious - also miracles happen. People fall thousands of feet and survive - I think it was more that the SK didn't want to repeat the mistake of the mafia.

I think the most important thing you pointed out though was their knowledge of The Needle which would most likely assume someone that has lived in Seattle for a little time and eliminate some of the drifters, hobbos, and those visiting (including one nurse).

I forgot that Emerald also had a japan background

I already made a suggestion. =p

Actually upon rereading it isn't apparent that the SK knew those facts about the needle

Regardless I'm pretty sure I now know the SK collecting more data before I point a big flopping finger lol

I don't have big, floppy fingers...just kinda short ones, but they point very well! lol

Mine were gonna point at you, but I may have just found an even bigger target so now I"m confused - give me a few :D I'll just post all the clues at once once I get to that point

Point away, but you'd be so utterly, and totally wrong, and would have NOTHING to support your theory :P

:looney I swear's I'm totally sane.