*sulks* I want to be part of a club.
Nobody loves me.
Round 7 - OOC
Discuss
Verileah
16 years ago
nickenstien
16 years ago
Do you want to be in my Pirates-without-Parrots club?
WAHHHHHH!!!!!
Verileah;95140
*sulks* I want to be part of a club.
Nobody loves me.
Do you want to be in my Pirates-without-Parrots club?
WAHHHHHH!!!!!
MashPotato
16 years ago
Yes, Lemmy told me he was going to ID Darsa, but I don't see how that translates into me being mafia because she happened to get hit. In fact, doing that just bolstered his role of sheriff in my eyes, since hey, he said she was a townie, and then she got hit!
You certainly fooled me. If you look at our votes, we always voted the same way after you were "outed" as the sheriff.
You do realize that as a mafia, us townies can't rely on your word?
Some of this is true, but the interpretation has been skewed. I did wonder who was in the club, because I didn't want to lynch any townies... as Lemmy said, this was at an earlier stage in the game, and there likely were plenty of mafia around who could have used mistaken voting to their advantage.
I did ask about MEC, because I thought uncovering mafia would be more useful than clearing townies.
Anyway, this is turning into a "he said, she said" conversation
. Later on, I'll post some stuff from the hits themselves that show I'm not mafia 
lemmy101;95138
I should point out at this stage that I told Mash I was going to ID Darsa, and Darsa was then IDed (NOT MAFIA) and the same day Darsa got Mafia hit.
Yes, Lemmy told me he was going to ID Darsa, but I don't see how that translates into me being mafia because she happened to get hit. In fact, doing that just bolstered his role of sheriff in my eyes, since hey, he said she was a townie, and then she got hit!
You certainly fooled me
. If you look at our votes, we always voted the same way after you were "outed" as the sheriff.
This was stage 2 of my suspicions, stage 1 being where out of pure curiosity I put forward the proposal that I'd ID Mash *just to clear her* and get her into the "ok club"... and she artfully redirected the attention to MEC. (NOT MAFIA) and even probed for the names of "the OK club" since basically she's "pretty much probably ok" or something similar, despite me saying the rules for entry were a NOT MAFIA ID
Note this was when the amount of IDs that had been made at the time was small enough that it meant that the protected special role in the clan would easily have been figured out if I had given that list of names.
You do realize that as a mafia, us townies can't rely on your word?
Some of this is true, but the interpretation has been skewed. I did wonder who was in the club, because I didn't want to lynch any townies... as Lemmy said, this was at an earlier stage in the game, and there likely were plenty of mafia around who could have used mistaken voting to their advantage.
I did ask about MEC, because I thought uncovering mafia would be more useful than clearing townies.
Anyway, this is turning into a "he said, she said" conversation
. Later on, I'll post some stuff from the hits themselves that show I'm not mafia
lemmy101
16 years ago
"Anyway, this is turning into a "he said, she said" conversation 
. Later on, I'll post some stuff from the hits themselves that show I'm not mafia "
Please do! Though I doubt it'll do you any good, as since Mafia hits tend to have multiple people in them, or multiple people to draw from to be in them, any bit of evidence in one of the hits that "someone yelled" is not going to be conclusive like it would be for the SK. Also any evidence you have is bound to be bogus, as you ARE Mafia.
I must applaud your mafia lies to try and turn this on me, though! Much more convincing than Four Wind's attempts were!
. Later on, I'll post some stuff from the hits themselves that show I'm not mafia "Please do! Though I doubt it'll do you any good, as since Mafia hits tend to have multiple people in them, or multiple people to draw from to be in them, any bit of evidence in one of the hits that "someone yelled" is not going to be conclusive like it would be for the SK. Also any evidence you have is bound to be bogus, as you ARE Mafia.
I must applaud your mafia lies to try and turn this on me, though!
Much more convincing than Four Wind's attempts were!
nickenstien
16 years ago
So which way is it?!? You either do get the result of ID even if that person is doomed, or you do not.
lemmy101;95128
Because AFAIK you probably wouldn't get an ID if you got mafia hit the same day
lemmy101;95128
I should point out at this stage that I told Mash I was going to ID Darsa, and Darsa was then IDed (NOT MAFIA) and the same day Darsa got Mafia hit.
So which way is it?!? You either do get the result of ID even if that person is doomed, or you do not.
lemmy101
16 years ago
Originally Posted by lemmy101
A: Because AFAIK you probably wouldn't get an ID if you got mafia hit the same day
Originally Posted by lemmy101
B: I should point out at this stage that I told Mash I was going to ID Darsa, and Darsa was then IDed (NOT MAFIA) and the same day Darsa got Mafia hit.
a) I meant if the SHERIFF gets Mafia Hit.
b) I meant if the target of the ID got hit.
nickenstien;95148
So which way is it?!? You either do get the result of ID even if that person is doomed, or you do not.
Originally Posted by lemmy101
A: Because AFAIK you probably wouldn't get an ID if you got mafia hit the same day
Originally Posted by lemmy101
B: I should point out at this stage that I told Mash I was going to ID Darsa, and Darsa was then IDed (NOT MAFIA) and the same day Darsa got Mafia hit.
a) I meant if the SHERIFF gets Mafia Hit.
b) I meant if the target of the ID got hit.
MashPotato
16 years ago
FourWinds (assuming he WAS mafia, I was going on your word about that) was a mafia sacrifice, of course he's not going to lay it on you thick, but rather muddy the waters. Which he did!
In fact, I note that you keep mentioning that Fourwinds was the only confirmed dead mafia. All the better to draw attention to your safe sheriff role, no? You out one of your fellow mafia, then keep referring to it, insisting that he's the only mafia who's dead. Maybe that's the truth, maybe it's just a ploy to keep us guessing about how many mafia really are left. I don't know...
EDIT: btw, took out a reference, I was thinking of the wrong person
lemmy101;95147
I must applaud your mafia lies to try and turn this on me, though!
FourWinds (assuming he WAS mafia, I was going on your word about that
) was a mafia sacrifice, of course he's not going to lay it on you thick, but rather muddy the waters. Which he did!In fact, I note that you keep mentioning that Fourwinds was the only confirmed dead mafia. All the better to draw attention to your safe sheriff role, no? You out one of your fellow mafia, then keep referring to it, insisting that he's the only mafia who's dead. Maybe that's the truth, maybe it's just a ploy to keep us guessing about how many mafia really are left. I don't know...
EDIT: btw, took out a reference, I was thinking of the wrong person
Verileah
16 years ago
You get your ID whether the mafia hits your ID or not (though I personally have never allowed a sheriff to ID corpses).
However, if the sheriff asks for an ID, and the sheriff gets hit, it's a little more up in the air and can depend on the timing of things. They might get their ID and then die before being able to talk, they might get their ID and immediately tell everyone in sight, or (especially if SKIDS are left to the last minute) they might not get their ID at all because there would be no point. I think almost always give the sheriff their ID no matter what but it absolutely makes sense to not to that in the case of a lost cause, as it would only drive the poor sheriff nuts.
However, if the sheriff asks for an ID, and the sheriff gets hit, it's a little more up in the air and can depend on the timing of things. They might get their ID and then die before being able to talk, they might get their ID and immediately tell everyone in sight, or (especially if SKIDS are left to the last minute) they might not get their ID at all because there would be no point. I think almost always give the sheriff their ID no matter what but it absolutely makes sense to not to that in the case of a lost cause, as it would only drive the poor sheriff nuts.
nickenstien
16 years ago
Yes, of course I see the difference here. However what you fail to mention is why that should be different in any way? In both cases it would be the result of and ID being returned _before_ any mafia hits were posted. So I don't see how the speculation of the sheriff being _possibly_ treated different in this situation is any kind of valid argument in the first place.
lemmy101;95149
Originally Posted by lemmy101
A: Because AFAIK you probably wouldn't get an ID if you got mafia hit the same day
Originally Posted by lemmy101
B: I should point out at this stage that I told Mash I was going to ID Darsa, and Darsa was then IDed (NOT MAFIA) and the same day Darsa got Mafia hit.
Yes, of course I see the difference here. However what you fail to mention is why that should be different in any way? In both cases it would be the result of and ID being returned _before_ any mafia hits were posted. So I don't see how the speculation of the sheriff being _possibly_ treated different in this situation is any kind of valid argument in the first place.
lemmy101
16 years ago
The difference being, conceptually, that a Sheriff could find out through investigation that someone who's dead is Mafia or not, but a dead Sheriff isn't gonna find anything out, is he? I kinda assumed if the mods got a Mafia SKID at the Sheriff, they would withhold the Sheriff's ID as in their eyes the Sheriff is dead.
Anyway Veri has clarified it all.
nickenstien;95154
Yes, of course I see the difference here. However what you fail to mention is why that should be different in any way? In both cases it would be the result of and ID being returned _before_ any mafia hits were posted. So I don't see how the speculation of the sheriff being _possibly_ treated different in this situation is any kind of valid argument in the first place.
The difference being, conceptually, that a Sheriff could find out through investigation that someone who's dead is Mafia or not, but a dead Sheriff isn't gonna find anything out, is he? I kinda assumed if the mods got a Mafia SKID at the Sheriff, they would withhold the Sheriff's ID as in their eyes the Sheriff is dead.
Anyway Veri has clarified it all.
MashPotato
16 years ago
As Lemmy mentioned, the mafia hit clues are difficult to use to prove innocence... but I'll try my best I'll post more later, but first here's some excerpts from the third mafia hit:
Some points:
1) Rosa hates going into port. Since the mafia is a group, it would make sense for her not to go.
2) If she didn't go, it WOULD make sense for her to remain on her boat, and this is the boat mentioned in the hit.
3) in the bios, it's stated that Rosa's boat is Squirrel Lips' stolen boat, The Golden Sunset. Therefore, SL wouldn't think "This however was clearly not his boat."
4) there's no indication in the bio/picture that Rosa knows how to use a sword, or even if she has one. If she's got a massive hook for a hand, why not use that?
I'll post more later, but first here's some excerpts from the third mafia hit:Another day, another port. There was much to do before the tiny vessel could leave. First task was to make one final bribe to the Harbormaster. A greedy man only too eager to help himself to a share of a pirates gold. The bribery had three stages. First was the town government, then came the local law enforcement, and lastly the harbormaster. All could make trouble for a pirate if the proper palms were not greased. That was the pirate's life.
...
The Captain awoke groggily with a fierce ache in his skull. The smell of salt and the sound waves told him that he was at see. This however was clearly not his boat. His assailants stood before him somber and mirthless. The drawing of swords made their intent quite clear.
Some points:
1) Rosa hates going into port. Since the mafia is a group, it would make sense for her not to go.
2) If she didn't go, it WOULD make sense for her to remain on her boat, and this is the boat mentioned in the hit.
3) in the bios, it's stated that Rosa's boat is Squirrel Lips' stolen boat, The Golden Sunset. Therefore, SL wouldn't think "This however was clearly not his boat."
4) there's no indication in the bio/picture that Rosa knows how to use a sword, or even if she has one. If she's got a massive hook for a hand, why not use that?
Hiejinx
16 years ago
OK, done some voting analysis on the folks left. Since everyone still alive voted for Caine in Round 3 we have to assume he was sacrificed by someone who is now still here and mafia. No way to pick out the SK from this. Lemmy and MP are both included here as well, sheriff or no sheriff....
Following Caine's probable sacrificial demise in round 3......
Round 4: the ones alive that did not vote for Cleene are: BR/Nola, Veri/Nova, Snow/Rosa, Lill/no vote, and Mike/Darsa.
The question to ask is was Cleene mafia and one or more of these thought one sacrifice was enough or was he townie and they couldn't support another victim?
Round 5 the non voters for Jin (who I now believe was townie) are: BR/Darsa, Veri/Cai.
Same question -- or did they just want to not be on a lynch the townie bandwagon?
Round 6 the non voters for Lilith were: Veri/Mary, and CGE/Mary
Again same questions
We can almost make the assumption Darsa, Jin, Astralfire and Lilith were all townies since nothing seems to have changed.
the most unusual voters for the last 3 rounds are:
BR: 4-Darsa, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
Veri: 4-Tor, 5-Cai, 6-Mary
Snow: 4-Rosa, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
Lillanya: 4-No vote, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
Mike: 4-Darsa, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
CGE's, MP's, Lemmy's and my vote were all: 4-Tor, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
the questions comes down to whether or not you believe Tor was mafia.....and I think the most consistent (excepting Caine in 3) townie voters are
Mike/Devilish Mary with: 1-Ortiz, 2-Bontempe, 3-Caine, 4-Darsa, 5-Jinheim, 6-Lilith.
Lillanya/Blackwater with: 1-Rosa, 2-Tre, 3-Caine, 4-No vote, 5-Jinheim, 6-Lilith.
and I suspect them both -- one as mafia and one as the SK.
I apologize for shortening Captain names and user names - this is just my shorthand for tracking.
** note to Jinheim - I'm trying to do you proud. My very first game you amazed me with the whole spreadsheet of the voting patterns and your deductions.
as well, sheriff or no sheriff....Following Caine's probable sacrificial demise in round 3......
Round 4: the ones alive that did not vote for Cleene are: BR/Nola, Veri/Nova, Snow/Rosa, Lill/no vote, and Mike/Darsa.
The question to ask is was Cleene mafia and one or more of these thought one sacrifice was enough or was he townie and they couldn't support another victim?
Round 5 the non voters for Jin (who I now believe was townie) are: BR/Darsa, Veri/Cai.
Same question -- or did they just want to not be on a lynch the townie bandwagon?
Round 6 the non voters for Lilith were: Veri/Mary, and CGE/Mary
Again same questions
We can almost make the assumption Darsa, Jin, Astralfire and Lilith were all townies since nothing seems to have changed.
the most unusual voters for the last 3 rounds are:
BR: 4-Darsa, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
Veri: 4-Tor, 5-Cai, 6-Mary
Snow: 4-Rosa, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
Lillanya: 4-No vote, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
Mike: 4-Darsa, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
CGE's, MP's, Lemmy's and my vote were all: 4-Tor, 5-Jin, 6-Lilith
the questions comes down to whether or not you believe Tor was mafia.....and I think the most consistent (excepting Caine in 3) townie voters are
Mike/Devilish Mary with: 1-Ortiz, 2-Bontempe, 3-Caine, 4-Darsa, 5-Jinheim, 6-Lilith.
Lillanya/Blackwater with: 1-Rosa, 2-Tre, 3-Caine, 4-No vote, 5-Jinheim, 6-Lilith.
and I suspect them both -- one as mafia and one as the SK.
I apologize for shortening Captain names and user names - this is just my shorthand for tracking.
** note to Jinheim - I'm trying to do you proud.
My very first game you amazed me with the whole spreadsheet of the voting patterns and your deductions.
Verileah
16 years ago
Might want to check those numbers again. Might also want to include yourself in the voting patterns.
Blackrabbit
16 years ago
Had VERY long post typed out.
Deleted VERY long post so as to keep my thoughts to myself at this time, but it did clarify a thing or to to get it down on "paper," as it were.
Once again, will reread hits and bios and see what we can come up with.
Deleted VERY long post so as to keep my thoughts to myself at this time, but it did clarify a thing or to to get it down on "paper," as it were.
Once again, will reread hits and bios and see what we can come up with.
Hiejinx
16 years ago
LOL, but Veri, I know I'm a townie and I did include how I voted for rounds 3, 4, 5 & 6 in my analysis. I say it in my post.
Round 1 I was not going to vote against Vudu, I have to live with him. and I would never hear the end of a first round vote to axe him.
Round 2 - no vote - I was at the movie theater watching The other Boleyn girl.
Round 1 I was not going to vote against Vudu, I have to live with him.
and I would never hear the end of a first round vote to axe him. Round 2 - no vote - I was at the movie theater watching The other Boleyn girl.
Blackrabbit
16 years ago
Which, incidentally, is the most atrocious mangling of a damn good novel I have ever seen in my life, period.
Carry on.
Carry on.
SnowDragon
16 years ago
Can I just say that after reading through all the post by Lemmy and Mash I am totally confused. As far as why I did not vote for Cleene was because I did not believe him to be guilty and that is why I went with Rosa as far as my vote. I am going back to reread bios yet again. *sigh*
Blackrabbit
16 years ago
Then ignore the posts by Lemmy and Mash and simply look for clues. Because one or both of them are full of shit, and at least one is trying to screw with our heads.
The only concrete facts are in the bios and the hits.
The only concrete facts are in the bios and the hits.
lemmy101
16 years ago
Don't do that. If we don't hang Mash tomorrow then we're going to lose this game. I doubt she's the last, and we're quickly running out of townies.
Don't do that. If we don't hang Mash tomorrow then we're going to lose this game. I doubt she's the last, and we're quickly running out of townies.
lemmy101
16 years ago
Okay, I'll just put this in black and white. Take what you want from it, hell, hang me for being a devious Mafia if you like...
but bear in mind that I WILL be confirmed right when the roles are revealed, and it is also by far the more likely scenario, statistically speaking, out of the two put forward...
Rosa IS Mafia
And if you don't hang Rosa, then Townies are a step closer to destruction.
Congrats to Mash for doing a very good job of bringing the fact into question, but the chances that I'm Mafia are tiny. Seriously consider how unlikely it is I could get doc protection, know I got protection, and stage my own hit after only ONE lot of SKIDS since the game started, if I was Mafia.
Then consider how likely it is that this is just a straightforward confirmation of someone's Mafianess, and a public announcement so everyone knows of her evilness.
Rosa IS Mafia
There's probably more than one left, I'm not confident on we got any figured out beyond FW and MP, but that's no excuse not to kill any Mafia we're fortunate enough to get confirmed, as soon as possible.
That's all I'm going to say on the matter, I know Mash is AFK for tonight so I'll wait for her (no doubt clever) rebuttal tomorrow. She's a much more convincing liar than FourWinds was!
but bear in mind that I WILL be confirmed right when the roles are revealed, and it is also by far the more likely scenario, statistically speaking, out of the two put forward... Rosa IS Mafia
And if you don't hang Rosa, then Townies are a step closer to destruction.
Congrats to Mash for doing a very good job of bringing the fact into question, but the chances that I'm Mafia are tiny. Seriously consider how unlikely it is I could get doc protection, know I got protection, and stage my own hit after only ONE lot of SKIDS since the game started, if I was Mafia.
Then consider how likely it is that this is just a straightforward confirmation of someone's Mafianess, and a public announcement so everyone knows of her evilness.
Rosa IS Mafia
There's probably more than one left, I'm not confident on we got any figured out beyond FW and MP, but that's no excuse not to kill any Mafia we're fortunate enough to get confirmed, as soon as possible.
That's all I'm going to say on the matter, I know Mash is AFK for tonight so I'll wait for her (no doubt clever) rebuttal tomorrow. She's a much more convincing liar than FourWinds was!