What to tell your kids?

I read this book years ago and in that world people weren't allowed to breed with others of the same "race". So if two white people were in love, they couldn't have a baby without breaking the law. I wonder if that actually happened, what color everyone would end up being. A tan-ish yellow?

My husband's theory is that the human race will all be tan-ish within 200 years. I think it will take longer than that, but I do think it's just a matter of time before interracial breeding eliminates racial differences. Then we'll have to find a new reason to hate one another. Well, there's always religion to fall back on. :roll:

Ugh. Id rather discuss race with a large group of people I barely know than religion. I can at least name the majority of races, religions, oh dear, I havent a clue how many there are. Hundreds and hundreds. And you can forget not offending someone on that subject. Race, at least in my opinion, is no where near is sensitive (except in some cases) as religion.

I think both are stupid reasons to fight.

However, I pose a question to you all. It is said that putting "In God We Trust" on things in public view is against peoples rights. What about my rights as a Christian? Dont I have a right to see it? I didnt force you to read it, I didnt tell you you had to believe it or die. I also didnt take down your porn, guns, murderous films, blasphemy, and other things I dont believe in myself, so why take the few things I have a right to believe in, the only things I have left, from me?

I understand that its not fair to push religion of ANY sort on anyone. But why is it that its only the non believers rights that get noticed?

Just a thought for discussion. :)

Nalla I think we should start a whole new thread for this one....

I don't believe that God should be on money, period. I think it's blasphemous.

I also don't believe that God should be included in our Pledge of Allegience. It was originally written as, "I pledge allegiance to my Flag and the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all." "Indivisible" was replaced with "under God" in 1954. Our nation was founded with the principle that church and state should be separate. While it is true that the majority of our population are Christian our pledge should include our ENTIRE population. In my opinion, God does not belong anywhere in our government.

I do like the idea that under God shouldnt be on money, that it is blasphemous. I dont think it being in our goverenment is such a bad thing, but more was thinking on the post office, where it was also removed from, and The Ten Commandments, where it was removed from a Court house. I guess I can understand also, that the commandment "Thou Shalt worship no other God before me" wouldnt be followed by all, but arent most of the commandments written what our court is trying to bring justice for? Thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, thou shalt not commit adultry. (ok not those exact words, but you get the meaning.)

(I do love a good discussion :) )
BTW if these are the wrong forums for such discussion plz do let me know. I know some think forms of discussion religion rather offensive, and I dont mind taking it somewhere else or just dropping it. I do realize its kind of a derail too, so Ill start another somewhere too. I was just thinking about the title, what to tell your kids, adn thinking of mine as well, what to tell them one day when they ask "Why cant I talk about God?", cause I fear it will come to that.

To say that the 10 commandments (with the exception of the one about worshipping other gods) is strictly Christian is pretty silly. These are principles found within many different societies, some of which have never even seen or heard of the bible. They are basic moral statements. The Christians just decided to give them an official name and put them in stone.

However, putting something specifically labeled as "The Ten Commandments" including a statement about religion which would be decidedly Christian in a place of government or law in a society that has one of its founding tenents to keep church and state separate is a gross violation. Sure, the people subscribing to that religion would have no problem with that, but what if every other religion represented in the country wanted equal treatment? I can tell you there are a lot more than a handful of religions out there and some of them are very contradictory or even completely opposing. That would turn things into a huge mess. Rather than try to tiptoe around the subject and pick and choose which stay and which go, it's better to deal with none at all. The US has its roots in a desire to escape religious oppression. We shouldn't be starting it all over again.

Keeping our American viewpoints of seperating church and state out of it, a God fearing individual might be smarter to think about what God wants. God dictates himself whether or not church and state should be seperated:
"Give back Caesar's things to Caesar but God's things to God." We're so eager to put our Christian belief structure on everything as if we're trying to prove it to somebody...but the truth of the matter is that our Christian God wants none of it. Christians who are hung up on having the Lord's Prayer in schools, and connecting discussions of God with politics might do well to spend more time reading their bibles ;) Why would a just and loving God want to be associated with nations (not just ours...every nation on earth sticks God into it somewhere at some point) that declare war on other nations for the sake of their own selfish pursuits? And do we honestly think he's on "our" side versus theirs? In God we Trust...to do what? To take care of our bank accounts? To make sure our President isn't messing up? Hardly. God doesn't need us to do his PR that way. I think he'd be much more satisfied if we were more excellent to eachother and left his name out of it.

hahahahaha Be excellent to each other.

I can definatly see your point, however, the reasoning for wanting things out there for others to see imo would be 1) to let others know of His love and 2) so that I can feel better about myself. Having Prayer in school every day was something in middle school that I relied on as a christian to help my day be stronger and better. Luckily I still had the moment of silence in high school, but theyll take that soon too. How long before they comfiscate Bibles from our children saying that it is offensive to those around them? Why would ajust and loving God want to be associated with our nations? Why, for the same reason he lived and died in our nations. To help us, because He IS just and loving. see, people think an entitiy such as our Lord wouldnt want to be associated with it, when thats all He wanted to begin with. He had supper with bank robbers, and had His feet washed by a whore who used her hair. Whats a little war to Him? In God We Trust.. to do everything. Protect us, watch us, help us, feed us, clothe us, love and protect our babies, bring our sons home safe from war, and bless us.
2 Samuel 22:31 As for God, his way is perfect; the word of the LORD is tried: he is a buckler to all them that trust in him.
And as far as our President goes, we better hope God is watching and helping him make the right decisions. Your children and mine will pay the costs if not. The world is already sad enough with the past leadership weve had.
Leaving God's name out of it is denying what He done for us, to a point. He wouldnt have sent his Son here if wanted to stay out of it all.
;)

Teachers aren't allowed to lead children in prayer, but children are still permitted to pray in school as long as they are not disruptive to the learning environment. Judges may pray in their chambers. There is a time and place for everything.

At any rate...I totally don't relate to the "it would make Christians feel good about themselves" argument.

pretty much.

Tis

I pledge allegience to the flag and the republic for which it stands one nation under god, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.


I do not however believe in discussing religon or politics EVERYONE has a right to thier own beliefs.

Thats why our men and women are in uniform to ensure that right

But, by discussing it, do you feel Im pushing it on you? I mean no ill harm, I love discussing things. Its our right to be able to discuss it, and if we didnt, how would we know what others beliefs were? Im open ears, and I love hearing about other peoples definitions of things. Religion or otherwise. This wasnt started to convey the message that you guys are wrong, I hope that wasnt what you gathered. Only that its fun to talk about these things and discuss the differences. I guess I get this from my fave english teacher in school. It didnt matter if he believed in something or no, if he started a discussion on it, hed get us all riled up and talking about it, and it was a lot of fun to me. Thats just the way I feel, some arent so comfortable in talking about it, and thats fine :)

that's a by-product. not the reason. police and military are for enforcing and carrying out some leader's goals and rules.

one can only hope those rules and goals are what they are presented to be.

If we pray to Christian gods to fortify Christians, we should pray to Hindu gods to fortify Hindus. At some point it might be nice if they put some time effort and thought into actually EDUCATING these children instead of praying all day long. My children will pray at home, with their parents and will know that they can look to God if they need to throughout the day...they don't need a loudspeaker to teach them how to pray or to tell them when to do it.

As to war...I find it impossible to imagine a God who would be involved in war not because he is not concerned for our welfare, but because he has given us the gift of free choice and we have the choice to either do good or do evil with it and to suffer the consequences of those actions. As it so happens, much of humanity is led by sinful inclinations and therefore make incorrect choices. The bible says "It is not for man who is walking even to direct his own step." And then even as we make those choices, good or bad, we opt to put the blame on God for the outcome. Given history, and the wars waged in the name of God, can you with a clear conscience suggest that He wanted to be involved? What makes you think that our current governments are beyond reproach so that they can say that God is "blessing" them? This is exactly why so many are disenchanted with religion. Where was God's blessing on 9/11? Hitler was a Christian...is burning Jews and countless of others something God signed up for? Where was God when we bombed Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Or how about those soldiers who forced the war prisoners to do those terrible acts in Iraq? The years of slavery in this country and segregation...the KKK is a "christian" organization too. Are these activities blessed by a loving and just God? We have no right to make selfish choices for the welfare of our own country, nor does any other country dictator or organization for that matter, and then to blame those choices good or bad on God (any God, Christian or otherwise) or involve him in them. If our President is a godfearing holy rolling Christian as he claims, then it is up to him to pray on his own for his own decisions and for guidance in those decisions. But once those decisions are made, they are HIS decisions. Not God's. And to put God's name on them after the fact...well it's wrong from a Christian point of view, let alone a secular one.

I would just like to point out the the 10 Commandments were originally Jewish. Thus speaketh the token Jew. ;)

Much :heart to Gilae for everything you've said on the subject. :cheer

And LOL @ Ryala for the "Bill and Ted's" reference. /giggle.

I am all for your rights as a Christian (Muslim, Hindu, whatever...) to pray in school, work, wherever; as long as you don't try to force it on me. Saying that I have to include the phrase "under God" in the Pledge of Allegience IS forcing me to pray and I won't have it. It IS unconstitutional and it should not ever have been put in there.

The first ammendment reads: [q]
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances. [/q]

Putting God into government or any type of government function is establishing religion. I could see putting the 10 commandments in a courhouse only if it were done as an historical reference, such as stating that our own laws are loosely based on these commandments.

This continued trend of including religion in our government is a very strong argument in favor of me moving to Germany instead of having Marky move here.

Did you read about the war where Abraham (Im almost positive, though I could have the name wrong) where God said hed help them win as long as the old man kept his arm raised high above his head? You see, I was thinking about the same thing you are saying not long ago, so i got to reading about it. I wondered how in the world killing of any kind can be justified to Him. But not everyone agrees with us, so therefore at some pts we will have to defend our beliefs and our rights. Since Biblical times, the way to do that was war. There is a lot of war in the Bible. God stood behind his people too. I guess, your reasons have to be right maybe. I definatly think going to war to defend your families and going out to the street and murdering someone is two totally different things, and I know God must see it that way too. I know a sin is a sin, but even God himself said a man should defend his family. Also, I wondered about a God, who could send a father out with his young son and tell him to kill him, for His sake. Doesnt that sound a lil self righteous? /shrug Abraham did it, but was saved last min by an angel from having to kill his own son. ITs all very confusing at times, thats one reason I like to talk about it. Different point of views from different folks help others (like myself or anyone else for that matter) to understand.
I guess this right here would depend on the war, and why. We fight for a lot of different reasons now than we used to. When the Japanese dropped bombs on us and threatened our families (sort of how Bin Laden has now, only Bush went after the wrong traitor...) yes I think anyone could justify that, after all, God did say turn the other cheek, but I dont think he meant to let people kill us all off and smile about it.


Im not exactly sure what your saying here, Ill come back to it.


Im gonna answer this one then Im gonna have to come back. Ive got my eggs burning!! lol This is a page I found a long while back I had emailed to a few friends, I hope maybe this is what you mean.

http://www.swapmeetdave.com/United/Where.htm

I do agree that saying anything was "Gods Decission" is wrong, its how Hitler, Bin Laden, and the rest not only make Christians look bad, but they cant stand up and say "Hey, I felt like blowing something all to hell." They feel they have to attach it to a higher power so that makes it ok. And it doesnt. Just the same Ive seen Murderers say that God sat in a corner of their room and told them to murder people cause they were sinners, and therefore no great loss to the community. In Gods eyes, any loss of a life, especially a sinning one, is horrible, because they dont have the chance that so many others got. So that not only portrays bad judgement of the Bible and God, but makes others think "Well who wants to be a part of that?"

Ok my eggs are on fire now, Ima gonna check em. This is been very interesting discussing with you gals. You have bright ideas and your very smart women. Im glad to know you all :)

Men wrote the bible. The bible is an accounting of history. History tends to be written by the victors. The victors tend to write things to paint themselves and their actions in a positive light. Put it all together and the men who wrote the bible say God supported them and since they were the victors then they must be right.

I guess that tends to go back to your beleifs, to tho, because it is my own beliefs that the Bible was indeed written by God's men, apostles, disciples and the like, but it was originally copied letters from the churches, and interpretations of visions of God, and accounts of what happened. And yes you are right, beauty is in the eye of the beholder, and so is any other story for that matter, it all depends on whos watching.

The Bible itself was these letters and scrolls taken and interrpretted as closely as possible to english.

But then, that is arguable, depending on what you believe in. :)

For the record, I wanted to say something else that was on my mind too. Just in case I gave the opinon Im a holy roller better than thou (and God I hope I never do) I wanted to say that I think no certain religion will meet in the Kingdom of God. I proclaim to be a christian, and tho I go to a baptist church, I prefer the label of Non demoniational, just because there are somethings Ive read I beleive taht even some baptists dont believe, I believe what I feel in my heart is right, not what someone tells me is.

But anyhoo, what I was gonna say is, I dont think, as a Christian, that only Baptists wil meet in heaven, or (as Jehovah's Witness' believe) that the 144k are already there, or that Catholics are the only way or what have you. I dont exactly believe the same as Catholics, but Ill be damned if I think Mother Teresa is going to hell. You know? I think everyone of us is probably right in our own way.. AFter all, God didnt explain everything to us, and we will never know until He takes us home I beleive, therefore we have to fill in the blanks, no?
Just wanted you guys to know that. :)